# United Overseas Bank Limited — FY 2024 Full-Year Financial Results Media Briefing

- Event: FY 2024 Full-Year Financial Results Media Briefing
- Date: 19 February 2025
- Kind: automated speech recognition (ASR) transcript, unverified, no speaker labels
- Source webcast: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dLEOAsUM4LA
- Duration: 50:45 (~6,980 words)
- Presenters (per UOB's announcement, not per-turn): Wee Ee Cheong (Deputy Chairman & CEO) and Lee Wai Fai (Group CFO)

Unofficial machine transcript. Prepared by SMID Research from the issuer's public results webcast recording by automated speech recognition, without a full manual check: expect mis-heard names and figures. No speaker labels are given; timestamps refer to the recording. Not a company publication. UOB's results webcast is the authoritative record. Copyright in the briefing rests with United Overseas Bank Limited; contact contact@smidresearch.com for corrections or removal.

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[0:00] Good morning everyone and welcome to UB's fourth quarter, 2024 results media briefing. Today we have with us our deputy chairman and CEO, Mr. V.H. Hong, who will give a broad overview of how our franchise has performed and the operating landscape. We also have our group CFO, Mr. Li Wifi. Wifi will go into more details on the financials and business performance from the quarter and for the full year. After both presentations, we'll be taking questions from the media. Now I'd like to invite you to get us started. Mr. Li Wifi. Thank you. Thank you everyone. Good morning. Thank you for joining us today. With ongoing geopolitical tensions and tariffs, the outlook for the year remains uncertain.

[0:47] We are closely monitoring developments. So far, our CNYN continues to be sealed. Mega trends such as supply change diversifications, digitalization and the green economy are driving investments into the region. CNYN is also moving towards closer cooperation. With recent developments such as your whole Singapore special economic zone and integrated cross-border retail payment system and the shape of our group. All this will help boost intra-ASEAN connectivity and growth. And we enforce the region's position

[1:35] as a key player in the global economy. In 2024, we achieved a good set of results. Full year net profit through 6% to a new high of 6 billion versus 2023 5.7 billion. We are pleased that we are making good progress in reshaping our income divers. In wholesale banking, our platforms and sector specific solutions enable us to better finance cross-border businesses. Leading to higher fee income and CASA group.

[2:22] 4% just to be year on year on loans and trade related fees. 16% year on year in CASA balance. Cross-border income and transaction banking now contribute a higher proportion of wholesale banking. Also, customer related trading and investment income saw a robust growth of 20%. In retail banking, our city acquisition has helped us scale our business in ASEAN. Cross-credit fees grew 18% for the year. Our newly reorganized private bank

[3:09] along with privileged banking are driving high network AUM. Our total AUM up 8% to 190 billion and well-management income which grew strongly by 30%. We are making good progress in shaping our businesses towards drivers that are recurring in nature and less sensitive to rate cycles. This may take time, but we are happy with the results so far and we will be laser focused on accelerating growth in this area. On the cost front, we are stepping up efforts to enhance productivity.

[3:56] Our cost income ratio for 2024 was 42.5%. Reflecting our cost structure as a regional commotion. In 2025, city related integration costs were roll off significantly. We expect CIR to be the low 40s in the next few years. ASEAN quality is sound and our book continue to be resilient. The uptick in specific provision last quarter was in line with our expectations and prudent policies and catered for by management overlay set aside earlier. Total credit costs remain within our guide

[4:44] 25 to 30 basis points last year. While we stay vigilant, we are gaining traction in reshaping our loan portfolio to more trade related exposures and diversifying our revenue base to more non-loan income. Given our business model and projections this year, we expect total credit costs again to remain 25 to 30 basis points. Funding base is also getting stronger. We solely gain in transaction floats from both retail customer business cash management services. Capital positions are at healthy level with excess CT1 even on the basis for fully loaded basis.

[5:36] The board has recommended a final dividend of 92 cents for ordinary share, bringing our full year dividend to 1.8 per share. We present a payout ratio of about 50%. This year marks the OB90 anniversary. For our shareholders, we are pleased to announce a 3 billion package to return surplus capital over three years. This comprises a special dividend of 50 cents per share payout over two tranches this year. And a 2 billion share buyback program

[6:22] to be executed over three years. Our disciplined approach of pursuing long-term growth, visibility, and service well. And we are confident of enhancing shareholders value in the years to come. Looking ahead, amid an uncertain world, we are confident that ASEAN economies are resilient and continue spread. We are committed to our ASEAN strategy. Our long-term investments in the region are paying off with early results. The momentum is picking up and we expect to see sustained revenue growth this year. Just for guidance,

[7:08] our this year guidance, we like to achieve high single digit long growth, double digit fee increase by led by cuts, wealth, trade, and loan related fees. Higher total income, cost to income ratio of around 42%, and total credit costs at 25 to 30 basis point. I will now invite Wi-Fi to share a little bit more detail. And I also like to take this opportunity in front of the Wi-Fi has been a lawyer staff of the bank for over 40 years. I think he will be stepping down

[7:55] and he will be watching us on the site. And I would like to take this opportunity to thank him for his dedication and contributions to the bank. And he has been a CFO for the last 20 years and is a valued member of our senior management team. I wish him all the best. Thank you very much. Wi-Fi. Thank you, Iseong. I think good morning, everyone. It's nice to see our view again, that's the vision. Okay, on the results itself, our full year profit, grow 6% to record 6 billion with an ROE of 13.3%. That profit for the quarter was 1.5 billion, 5% lower than the previous quarter.

[8:42] These income grew 7% to 2.4 billion, led by double digit growth in wealth management fees, alongside strong card fees and higher loan fees. Trading and investment income rose 15% to 2 billion for the full year, driven by robust customer related treasury income, as well as good performance from trading and investment and liquidity management activities. For the fourth quarter, net interest margin moderated down to 2% from the effect of interest rate cuts. Wealth and loan related fees was seasonally softer and trading and investment normalized to a 367 million after an exceptional third quarter.

[9:29] asset quality is state resilient with NPL ratio maintained at 1.5% with full year credit cost at 27 basis point within our guidance. We maintain our strong capital and funding position with CT1 at 15.5% and NSFR at 116% respectively. If our record profit, the board is proposing a second half dividend of 92 cents per share, bring the total full year dividend per share to 180. We are also pleased to announce a 3 billion package to return surplus capital over the next three years as part of our capital distribution strategy to reward our shareholders. I think the board is recommending a capital distribution package comprising

[10:16] of special dividend and share buyback as Yichang mentioned earlier. We are committed to deliver this over the next three years. A special dividend will be 50 cents or we paid in two trenches in 2025. We only pay dividend half yearly. So you get it in the two trenches this year. And we return close to 1 billion of our surplus capital. And this year also marks our UOB 90th anniversary. We have also introduced a 2 billion share buyback program to be executed over the next three years. Together, the package targets to return 3 billion of surplus capital, which will bring us closer to our capital level. Now back to the finishers.

[11:03] As mentioned, net profit for the year grew 6% to a record 6 billion boosted by strong fees income and trading investment income. Net profit for the quarter was 1.5 billion, 5% lower than previous quarter. You could note that the city integration costs have actually nearly taken off. As we have completed our operational integration in the key markets of Malaysia, Thailand and Indonesia. Thing was left is Vietnam, which is a small part of our portfolio. We saw healthy growth across our business franchise. Group retail registered total income of 5.5 billion for the year. The enlarged regional franchise is finally showing results.

[11:48] With double digit growth in low cost KASA, cut buildings and wealth income, which helped to cushion the pressure on margin. We are also happy to note that the total wealth fees, including the so-called customer related treasury income, actually they have grown 30% year on year to cross the 1.1 billion mark. Our group wholesale regional franchise is also doing well. Record investment banking fees, better customer flows, strong KASA and trade loans. If a diversified loan book helped cushion the drop in margin from declining interest rate and keen competition. For the year, net interest income was stable at 9.7 billion, supported by healthy loans growth

[12:34] offsetting the margin compression. Water and quarter net interest margin though it declined to 2% from the effect of interest rate cuts. Net interest income we helped steady at 2.5 billion from asset growth. For the full year, lost income grew 11% led by double digit growth in wealth management fees, along with stronger cut fees and the enlarged regional franchise. This income is from last quarter due to a seasonal slowdown in those related and wealth activities. However, our credit card fees maintain its momentum boosted by the year end holiday standard. Trading and investment income rose 15% to 2 billion for the year,

[13:20] driven by robust customer treasury income from increased retail bond sales and strong hedging activities, as well as good performance from our trading and liquidity management. For the quarter trading and investment income, like I mentioned earlier, normalized to 367 million after an exceptional third quarter that benefited from market worth to this. Total operating expense, excluding the one of increased 5% year on year to 6.1 billion, mainly from people and IT related investments. A full year core cost to income ratio at 42.5% reflects our regional commercial banking activities. Staff cost is well controlled

[14:06] at a 4% growth over the year. For 2025, we are focused to improve our productivity and staff efficiency. In the medium term, we target to keep the cost to income ratio in the low 40s range. The overall exact quality of our loans portfolio stay resilient. If NPL ratio maintained at 1.5%, the increase in new NPA formation for this quarter was due to a few non-systemic accounts. This will be within our expectation. If the higher recovery and write off total NPL ratio remained at 1.5% for the quarter. However, specific allowances goes to 52 basis points this quarter. This increase was mainly due to

[14:52] the same few corporate accounts in US and greater China. This will anticipate that enhance the release of some general allowances that we have earmarked previously. On a full year basis, total credit cost of 27 basis points were within our guidance. As the end of last year, group total allowances was 4.8 billion of each 2.7 billion was for the non-impaired assets. Overall, NPA coverage remained adequate at 91% or 194% after taking collateral into account. The loans saw a healthy 5% growth from a year ago, driven by broad based growth in wholesale, thumb loan, trade loans, and the retail mortgage.

[15:39] While loans growth was lastly contributed by Singapore, the RCN4 franchise also recorded good momentum with a 7% year-on-year growth. Customer deposits regrow steadily at 1% quarter and quarter. More important is with the emphasis on CASA. Our CASA deposit continued to expand, leading to the improved CASA to total deposit ratio of 54.6%. Our liquidity and funding position remains sound. If LCR at 143%, and NSFR at 116%, these are well above the minimum regulatory requirement. While there had been some volatility in credit costs during the year, the full year credit cost of the design basis point

[16:26] were within our expectation and earlier guidance. Our total capital remains strong and robust, with CT1 closing at 15.5%. Even on a fully loaded basis at 15.4%, it is well above our target operating level. On the back of this capital strength, we are confident to continue to deliver consistent and sustainable returns to our shareholders. This includes our core dividend payout, as well as surplus capital to be returned as part of our capital distribution strategy. With our record profit and strong earnings generation, our board is recommending a second half dividend of 92 cents per share.

[17:12] Like Yihong said, this translates from the full year to a 50% payout ratio. As mentioned earlier, the board is also proposing a special dividend of 50 cents per share to be paid in 2025 as part of the 3 billion package. We are also committed to a 2 billion share buyback program, including both the core dividend of 92 cents per half year and the special dividend of 50 cents. I think the total analyzed dividend per share will be at 234, $2.34. I think with that, I conclude my presentation. But before I pass back to the moderator, please allow me to say a few more words. I think as Yihong mentioned, I'll be stepping down as Group CFO after the AGM in April.

[18:00] I think I'd like to take this opportunity to thank Yihong and the board for giving me the honor to serve as Group CFO for the last 20 years. It has been a privilege and a great honor to be part of the team that transformed the group from a Singapore-based bank to a regional powerhouse. I'm very confident that with Yongchi coming on with the leadership of Yihong, it will bring you all to new heights. Thank you. Happy New Year, Ben. Thank you, Mr. Li. We'll now take questions from the media. For those dialing in, please use the recent function. Those in the room, please raise your physical hand and turn your hands. So, turn your hands, please.

[18:47] Well, congratulations on the numbers and another good year. I have three questions. The first one, can I ask about FIM, the interest margin expectations for 2025? Second question, access capital after the implementation of the 3 billion capital return program, what bill the dollar's number be? Meaning that how much money you have left after that. In excess capital after- By more than. The dry powder. Sorry, sorry. And the third question, I mean, UOB is among the banks that have benefited from Singapore's wealth status for a long time. What do you think in term of challenges,

[19:34] the challenges that the country has faced because there's also pressure from rising living cost and how does that, I mean, there are two sides of the point, basically. And how are you handling as the bank, the negative side that comes from Singapore's wealth hub status? Thank you. You want to address the technical aspect, the name as well as the- Capital. The capital. Okay, our name in the fourth quarter came down to 2%. I think this was the full impact of the Fed rate cut. Okay, in the last quarter,

[20:20] the US actually cut close to 1%. So that translate very sharply into the loans reprising. Wow, our cost will take time to react. Our outlook is that the Fed will not be as aggressive next year, this year, sorry, this year. One or two? We, at this time, the in-house deal is one. But like I say, every quarter, we could change here. But at this time, in-house deal is one. I mean, for good reason, right? If you look at the US itself, strong, strong economy take past. And also everybody is waiting for the latest foreign policy, which seemed to be quite inflation driven

[21:07] for rates to stay high. So with that, we hope and we are to maintain them at the current 2% level, okay? Which means that we will have to work very hard on our strategy of getting two things, our cross-border in. As Ishaan mentioned, our operating model is no longer just loans. If you really look at where GWB is, you're focusing a lot, a lot on the others, which are really the fees, and the loans related fees to hedging. And more important that I always feel that with our platform going in, a GWB, which is a wholesale, the Casa ratio is very strong. That to me is the best defense, no matter where it is.

[21:54] So we're hoping to stay at this level. That being said, I think it's hard work, which means that we will have to aggressively move towards managing our costs. And hopefully, if the rate cuts like we forecast will be the second half, at least there will be some, hopefully, some more stability in the first half, maybe for the rate cut. So we're hoping at this level. The second question is access capital. We actually wanted to, we commit that we want to bring down the CTY to 14%. So from a 15 to a 14, we came up with a 3 billion number. Okay, so there are two parts, if you realize, to our capital strategy. One is we call call dividend,

[22:41] second part is access funds. For technical, call dividend will be a function of your earnings. Okay, as our earnings grow, and we are quite confident as a commercial bank, we will probably grow it to 10% every year. Your dividend, your number, call dividend will grow. And the question is, will CTY go up above the 14? Okay, there are two reasons why it can, which is really that your earnings are stronger, the return on other day are stronger. And the second reason could be that you don't need capital for growth. At this point, we are still confident that ASEAN will grow, and the 8% RWA growth that I have telling you,

[23:28] we are quite hopeful, and we're very hopeful that that momentum will continue. So if you find that we have no needs for that, yes, then I'm sure as normal we will review the access capital to see whether we want to take more of the denominator, because which is different from the call dividend that we have. So for the time being, I think that we are confident we still have some work to do in the region, and we are confident that we need the RWA to actually push this vision of the regional growth. The regional franchise is actually happening. I mean, a few like Yichang mentioned, we are all in our very hopeful. So we think that that was sustained.

[24:13] If not, then two things that we look at, if you are the return on the RWA continues to be current level, and the CT1 continues to be high, then I'm sure that you will consider whether they need the exercise. But meanwhile, let us consume the 3 billion first. Yeah, yeah, but the amount of access capital post the 3 billion, how much is it? It's about slightly more than 14%. So like Yichang said, we are slightly above 14%. The question really would be that when you say access capital, okay, so it's where we pitch your access capital to. I mean, from 14 slightly to 14, maybe a few hundred million at this point, but that number could grow as the base grow. I see.

[24:59] Okay, which is why I'm saying that look at the strength of earnings coming in, okay? And if that grows, then I'm sure there will be a conversation to see whether we want to reduce the fully loaded CT1. So I think what is quite obvious that when we execute our capital management program, you will see the CT1 fully loaded dropping. Okay, that is probably your first indication. And after at which point if we finish the 3 billion, we expect it to be slightly above 14. And if the earning capacity is a lot stronger, then technically you'll be higher because you're adding to the place, which I'm sure management then will be in a position to re-celebrate that. The good news is, like I said,

[25:46] hopefully we got the asset quality out of the way. That's why despite the volatility earnings, we set GP, but my CT1 is confident. That's why we are confident to continue to do this capital strategy that we talk about. And that's probably something that we want to make sure that the earnings capacity is more important to us and growing our franchise in the region, growing the retail and the wholesale. I think that to us is important. That's coming in. You look at our same floor is actually shown as I mentioned in earlier slides. When you mentioned managed productivity, does it translate into any job cuts or any cuts in spending on staff in any way?

[26:32] I think productivity to me is more streamlining the process. How to improve the top market, that's important. Cutting costs is a very negative part of it. Yes, I think we will do it, but I think the end of the day is the process that we have. Today with AI, we should be able to make full use of it and to supplement our productivity, to streamline the whole top process. I think this is something we are working towards. But the cost cutting won't impact staff numbers. Yeah, but the cost cutting, we also have a lot of money.

[27:21] So we are trying to obscure our people. We are trying to channel the people into a high growth area. We are trying to train them. Hopefully certain part of the business can help the people. So it's a roundabout way of building, other than just cutting costs. I see, thank you. That's not what you talk about, Singapore as a well-centered, right? I think it's a good thing. The tailwind is strong. The fact is, Singapore is no different than any organization. To grow the top line is the most difficult part. And this is where I think you look at yesterday,

[28:10] the budget, I think is very prudent, inclusive in future already. And as a Singaporean, I think we're very encouraged. The government is taking care of us individually, families as well as corporates. Yes, the cost pressure is there. With more family officers coming to Singapore, I think our job is to create a sequence, how to make them committed to Singapore, how to enlarge the pie, because you know Singapore is facing a population. We need to welcome them to enlarge the pie, to make us more competitive as a country.

[28:58] The new initiative, Yoho in Singapore, again, that is one of the areas that can expand further. You look at JB, it's four and a half times the size of Singapore. If you are able to do well, that will be the benefit of Singapore. In fact, today we are actually, you'll be organizing with SDF. We are sending 100 dedications, right? Yes. To JB. And we signed MOU with Singapore Chinese Chamber of Commerce, as well as Malaysia Chinese Chamber of Commerce. The whole idea is given the cost structure of Singapore, how we can expand outside of Singapore, give us more space.

[29:44] And in both countries, I'm sure they are all quite like-minded. If they can do well, I think that will benefit both countries. Thank you, Mr. Lee. We get the next question. Your question on what do you think the Trump tariffs or upcoming policies are going to affect the business, especially in the region, is that it's going to come down towards the China plus one countries and not just China at this point? I think we are still watching. Watching, I think it will affect everybody, not just you. It will cut across for us and the whole region. I'm hopeful, I'm hopeful.

[30:31] At the end of the day, I'm sure every country is sensible enough. Let's try to deal with it. It's sensible. Hopefully, it's a good decision to make forward. At the end of the day, you can see what we are focusing on. Trade. That is important. People still need to buy things, still need to sell things. Focus on trade. Focus on something fundamentally benefited. Nobody. And the last time this we had spending a lot of our platform. It generated that. You can start to see the volume. Yeah. Could I just ask a couple of questions? First one, of course, is that the 52 basis points special SP

[31:22] was I thought was quite alarming. But if you could just give us some color on what that was. And also, you know, with Wi-Fi stepping down and everything, what's your philosophy on your securities book? I mean, because he's been, I don't know who manages it, but you know what, do you want to lengthen duration with 30 years rising or whatever you want to do with that? What is it? And then, OK. And then you said you use some of your management overlays for the SP. So you could, what's the figure like and what's the ideal figure? If you could, if you could on that. The last question is, can AI help with looking at the credits that you have?

[32:07] Yeah, if you could. So let me answer the first technical question. The easiest is a credit book person. Well, we lengthen, which is really how we manage. I think we have started lengthening. The question really would be where the long term should be. So you really look at the US today is 5% is tempting. And we have actually lengthened a bit. So I think that's something that we're watching. And whether Trump policy will work because his objectives to drive down long term and not short term. OK, so I think we're also watching that to make sure that our carrybook, that is here, says the process, which is the crew book,

[32:55] which will affect the end of the name itself. The process, the market. So we watched it closely, but technically, yes, we have started looking at it. Because today is not like two years ago, where it was 2%, 3%. I mean, today at 5%, I think at least that's not the leave carry. At the same time, you also have to be careful of the lock in gaps. You started to lock in too long. So at Elko, we discuss this every month itself. We are quite careful, but we have slowly started to add to that book. In fact, for the last few quarters. Your next question really, which is SP and MOs.

[33:41] I think the 50, I mean, that is actually two things that the SP that's coming in. One is a few chunky accounts that we mentioned. I think over the last few quarters, the last few months, there was more evidence market activities happening. Exiting. Not happening in the sense that you see structures being excluded. So two things, number one is the collateral value is actually at lower than what we normally expected. So hence, half of that is really meltdown in collateral value. It is a conservative standard we take, but we think that now doesn't mean that we'll get that loss. Because when you get out, we are quite hopeful that we get that.

[34:29] Because today, there are many voucher funds out there offering prizes that are ridiculous. But from the accounting standard standpoint, unfortunately, if there are evidence, we use that so that there are a few chunky accounts that we mentioned that previously, we were hopeful of restructuring. Recent events have indicated that either changes in management strategy or macro, we think that those events will not happen. Hence, we recognize that. And that's where the new NPL formation comes in. I mentioned most of this were in the US and greater China. I think US, we all know. We really look at the commercial assets with the US pricing coming down to ridiculous level.

[35:17] We decided to take the hit. So I think the US book, we are quite clean, at least going forward. We will still have some in greater China, not Asia. But those we think have some hope of recovery. So you saw us as a really thing. This is actually at the bottom now. This is why we are very prudent to make a contribution. And the MO is actually able to support all this. It's not an effective bottom line. So we show us your next question on MO. I think you all mentioned and asked. You have asked this and this have asked us, although we don't say the amount. Some of this weakness, we knew that we are not sure whether it will happen.

[36:05] Because we are hopeful that it doesn't. So previously, we had MO. So that's why we add MO to some of this. Because we saw this weakness. There always will be debate whether I can recover or not recover. But really, from a macro standpoint, if you feel that to be prudent, some of it might not happen. True enough, some of it didn't happen. So those are the MO that we added. That's why when this happens, it's not new to us. I think we have guided many times that we expect some weakness in NPL. But we think that they are either secure or we have MO to cover. So I think that's where we are. Enhance the reversal of MO.

[36:51] We don't disclose how much MO we have. But I think we have adequate. But the good news is the big chunk of your weakness in your book is taken out. I think that's the good news. Going forward, it will be a more stable goal. I do. Important not vanish. Otherwise, we will not come up with capital reductions. So basically, I think we are very positive. We are still targeting 25% to 30% credit costs. That is net loss. Whatever provision you see, the SP, these are all providers. Otherwise, we will not come up with high dividend capital. So you can see the management is very, very positive.

[37:37] This thing may be the next one to quarter. Certain account could be written back. But we just were being prudent. Fact is we are prudent means we are confident. We are not here to hide. We just pick it up front. And your last question on AI, whether it is a help credit. That's a tough call. Because if there's a silver bullet, I think we have done it long ago. A lot of credit is judgmental. But I think what AI can help is really market information. Because I think that would be more updated. But we still need a lot more prudent. And probably, the lesson learned is closer follow up.

[38:25] We need to follow cases because the market turned around so fast. We have never seen valuation drop so much in short time. Historically, we don't see this happening. We don't see it dropping 40%, 50% in one quarter. I think that's the lesson that we learned. But I think the bank has set up a team to really look at credit. More important is not to manage it after it comes on. It's before it comes on. I think that's where we wanted to. So while we clean up this history, we learned to make sure that the new one coming in would not result in another. So that's what we are doing. And I think that's the team that we are doing.

[39:10] So there is some market information on AI that we take. But it's really, in my mind, it's more market. Because in the wholesale, it's really individual credit. You have to know what they are doing. So AI don't have that information. AI, you can look at generic information on the whole country, so on and forth. GWA is very specific. So we have to learn that we have to be faster in our turnaround time, faster in management. And some of the external information will help us do that better. So how does all this relate to you? You're going regional. You're going to countries where you don't have as big a presence as you have in Singapore. How will all this relate to that

[39:57] and to your future growth? Well, you look at our region. You look at our four countries. You look at the nation. For a start, I think we are more consumer-based. Because to understand the market, to straight away book chunky words sometimes, you don't understand. You look at our title. It's all-consuming. And today, I think Malaysia after 73 years, Ireland after 25 years, we start to understand the market better. And this is where the whole zero piece will come in. Otherwise, in the past, it's all very material. There may be a type of system. Of course, if the whole country collapse,

[40:44] it's starting to get better. But I think this is where I think we are focusing on retail. And this is why during the COVID, we fought over the city. Because retail needs scale. It will live. And now that we achieved the moment, this is where the wholesale part will come in. So hopefully, we'll provide that. So maybe to add to each of the points, when we go in on the GWB, we always say that we have to understand customers. And there's this concept where you understand the value supply chain. Because when you're not the last in the to know, it's very dangerous.

[41:31] So when we look at sector solutioning, we look at supply chain, we look at cross-border, we look at cash management, that you understand where the cash flows are. Those are important for us. So that when we land, we understand where the cash flows will come in. It will be the source that comes in to take out that. And previously, if not when you do it, lying into the countries, the SME, you are the last to know. Singapore, we are actually very confident. Malaysia, we are quite confident because they've been there so long. In many other countries, you are the last. So the supply chain will give us the advantage hopefully that when the top is weaker, know that the bottom is a matter of timing coming in. So at the same time, you dare to land to the bottom

[42:16] because the cash flow come from the top. They will say that from the normal payment, they take off the loan to the supplier rather than it pay the supplier, answers the supplier to pay you. So those are things that we are actually fine-tuning, which is really very important is our knowledge of the region, our knowledge that we can bring different parts of the ecosystem together across different countries itself. But I think those are the things, and investment into our wholesale system in both trade and cash management is actually now very inclusive. It's also those we need to do better. Sigula, I want you to pay attention. You look at our cross-border income and our transaction banking. Now, you look at the cross-border,

[43:02] 26% of wholesale business now, the income. And then the transaction banking take up about more than 50%. We are trying to shift the shape of the wholesale rather than just continue to book chunky. This is why we are trying, and this is not overnight you can do that. In order to do that, you need to invest your infrastructure technology. You are talking about the last eight to 10 years. The way we are today is the flow business and the flow business is easier to predict. There are short-term in nature. This is the shape we're trying to do. Hopefully they are more out and out, WA friendly. Hopefully it doesn't take too much of the capital.

[43:48] This is why we are confident in capital grid, buy back and think better. So these are all the lesson that we've learned. But in order to do all this, we need to invest. This is why you look at our IT courses. You're talking about seven, eight hundred billion. Without technology, you can't do all this. You can't improve your cash. You early stage, but you can see we are shifting. Any other questions? Thanks for sharing. Can I just ask what is your top priority for this year? How will you continue to attract investments

[44:34] and what do you hope to achieve at the end of this partnership? I think we are basically still a commercial bank. I think you look at the tailwind is strong. The wealth continue to come in. You look at our private bank, our well business. Last year we achieved about 12 billion. I wouldn't continue to do that. Our emphasis is cross-sell. Rather than focus on individual, our wholesale banker, cross-sell, the wealthy individuals, the customer base, our private banking, and all privilege reserve. Like it's a business class kind of, right?

[45:20] Because we have the license for the whole ASEAN, and we are able to penetrate that. We have four, five hundred branches outside of this ASEAN. So we are actually trying to institutionalize the relationship. You look at our private bank, our overhead income is about 30, 40%. If you compare to some other private bank, they are talking about 78%. So to me, it's not just like AUM. End of the day is the total income day is not the thing. You can generate huge UAM, but what does it mean? It means nothing. So we are trying to institutionalize, try to have a lot of revenue synergy between wholesale and retail.

[46:07] And you look at Citibank franchise. We have 8.4 million, 5 million customer base. How you cross-sell? It's not just a one single product. This is where I think to answer your question, for this year, we try to hopefully get that happening. And this is our RE-friendly, well, our RE-friendly. And that's why supply change is concerned. Like trade system is trying to monetize it as aggressive as possible. So I'm still very hopeful, I think, even though the market is uncertain, in fact, if market is uncertain, if you understand the market, you actually have a better opportunity. The market is so bullish, everybody is bullish,

[46:56] then you don't have the opportunity. So it's a customer segment that we are going after. It's an experience that in the country that we are going. Since you. Sorry, just one follow up since you mentioned Wells, could you share net new money for 2024, please? Net new money for the Wells management. It's about 12 billion. 12 billion. You think about it? Am I right, actually? I just want to make sure. Net new money. Around 3 billion of water roughly. Singapore dollars. Singapore dollars. Because there's movement, right? So this is the net new increase.

[47:41] So there is also increase in market pricing and all. I mean, top net new. I think normally it's around 2 to 3 billion. We can come back to the exact number. The quarter is $20 billion. No, no, net new number. Net new money, this quarter is $20 billion. One year. But the whole year is new. I think it's around 2 to 3 billion. Four per quarter. So it's around 12 billion. We'll get you the idea. But we can confirm the exact number. I see. Thank you. Around the L.A. Yeah. So do you all see a business sentiment in China finally improving? I thought the soft market has improved. Among your financials. I think China is a big economy.

[48:27] In the long run, I'm confident. You go to China, see the infrastructure. You look at the people. They're well educated. I'm very confident. I think it may not be as fast as the oversupply of property markets. But you can see the soft market could be a leading indicator. They are focusing a lot on technology. But how much is the pent-up demand? I don't know. But today, I think it's a market that you cannot ignore. It's too big to ignore. You have the huge population base. So you have to be more selective.

[49:13] Generally, I think China is doing quite well. The country, China is to generate about 5% return. I think it's quite certain. Despite all this, there will be a pocket of uncertainty. So it's clear. Are any of your customers looking to go into China? Does anyone want to go? Yeah, they are people looking at it. Some of the funds are already going in. Otherwise, how can the soft market go up? There must be some multi-buy. The increase in the AUM for the wealth segment, there's significant flow from China. Yeah, some of the fund managers, they will locate. So it has a location.

[49:59] For some, US, Europe, some Asia. Obviously, China is the one. The private banking operations. Yeah, yeah. I mean, Chinese clients come to Singapore. Oh yeah, there are a lot of Chinese customers come to Singapore to help the new officers. So the net new is 12. Oh, because every quarter is 10. Selfie, right? For the full year. Thank you very much, Jeanette. My memory is still OK. Yeah, very good. Thanks for having us. No one ever doubts that at home. Any other final questions? They're all good. If not, thank you everyone. And if you have any further questions, we will book the team after that. Thank you.